I don't know if this is debated or not but, I'm pretty sure the actual enemy you fight in the route is the Shadow Mantle itself. It goes in the direction of the chest you need to pick it up in.
Whats the mouth then
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Generally when you are holding something, you will move in the same direction that the thing you are holding moves in.
The position of the chest is kind of irrelevant to whether the mantle is literally held or not.
Yeah but I just interpreted the mantle shaped enemy to be the mantle. The enemy is called "Shadow_Mantle_Enemy" in the files and all. Also the voice says "If you can catch it". Why would you refer to yourself as it (like in Deltarune's context anyways)
I've considered this before, but I don't so.
In the first round of the Mantle minigame, you can find a seemingly empty room. But when you walk inside, you'll catch a glimpse of the enemy flying away, and the words "See you soon" in black. It's implying that it was the enemy who left those words there. These words are in proper casing, as opposed to ALL CAPS. The only character who speaks with proper casing in those minigames is the voice.
Furthermore, invoking another character in this case does nothing to the story other than explaining this one inconsistency. This is a bad sign.
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The enemy says "If you can reach it" referring to the Shadow Mantle, not themselves.
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i feel like we should at least account for the possibility it is the shadow mantle itself
At most it's wearing the mantle
The mantle is very clearly an item
So are the Dealmaker and the Jevil's Tail, but they are very clearly still their secret bosses. The Dealmaker literally turns back into spamton in-front of us. For something as elusive as the mantle, I think it being a living piece of clothing fits it very well.
….
Now hold on just a minute, partner.
You may be into somethin.
The Devilsknife is clearly Jevil. The Jevilstail is clearly not. We know this because of the deliberately different ways Jevil refers to these two items. "TAKE ME AND DO YOUR STRONGEST—-!" for the Devilsknife and "TAKE THIS AND DO YOUR STRONGEST—-!" for the Jevilstail.
The Shadow Mantle Holder talks about the Shadow Mantle as if it was an item. It even says "... and the SHADOW MANTLE that I'm holding!" at some point. They are, without a doubt, separate.
The only argument to be had is if the Shadow Mantle Holder is a different character from the shadowy figure that we fight.
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Yeah I'm certain the voice is different, that's what I've been meaning here. That's what my post is saying, that the Shadowy figure is the Shadow Mantle and the holder is the voice.
I think it's interesting that the enemy you fight laughs at you while the voice itself is very sophisticated and straight forward. I don't think it's enough to make assumptions on it's own because I'm sure a sophisticated person can still make fun of someone they're fighting, but I think it adds to the idea that they might be different entities.
My apologies about the Jevilstail, I got them confused but it got the point across.
Is it? I always thought the voice had Flowey-like childishness quality.
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Looking at the dialogue again, I do think that's a good description for the voice. Tho personally I saw the way the voice talked as more how Seam talks, or perhaps how Ramb talks if they weren't being friendly to Kris.
Still, I feel like the enemy itself wouldn't be the one to say "...and the SHADOW MANTLE that I'm holding." as their design does not appear to be capable of holding the item for you. Also the whole fact that the enemy is called "shadow_mantle_enemy" in the files.
But it’s still Jevil, as it laughs when you use BET30
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It's almost certainly The Shadow Mantle.
Says "We both have work to do!" after beating it.
Looks a LOT like a Mantle. In comparison, Toby called King's cape a "cool mantle," and it looks similar to it when it falls off.
The only counter evidence against it is that it says, "This Shadow Mantle that I'm holding!" even though it could simply be lying about its nature. It's never seen actually holding anything, being conveniently hidden when it said that.
But why would it lie about that? It has nothing to gain from that
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For the sake of being viewed as more than just an armor, and more than just a video game obstacle you need to get pass. It definitely has intentions more than just being that.
It views "working" with Kris (being armor) as a collaboration than anything.
The "___ were used up" texts shows that the Sword Route gives a theme of things just being treated as items. Hell, even us as the Soul is presumably used as a tool because of its abilities.
John Mantle probably has significance to the freedom theming, belonging to Seam, being a secret boss, and has a great item as a reward, which is why I like this theory, if there's something that says otherwise that's more satisfying imo, than I'd probably stick to that, but this gives answers.
Or it's doing that to be a troll.
To be fair, The Mantle being possessed or controlled by another entity during the fight is also plausible, and more easily explainable by it simply trying to hide the identity of its controller.
I remind you Seam kept it in storage somewhere before it got stolen
It's very clearly an actual mantle itself. What people keep percieving as horns are the collar, made to look like horns for aesthetic purposes. If you would just look at its spitting attack sprite, you can see them flapping.
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