Maybe it’s too soon to make this case, but I wanted to say this while I still remembered.
I think it would be best for the future for the Deltarune wiki to rename the page that is currently titled “Snowgrave Route” to “Weird Route”, and have “Snowgrave Route” become a redirect. I understand that the current page name was the one chosen by community vote, but I have some arguments for why it would be best to change the name:
“Weird Route” is not solely an internal name like “Side B” and “Alt”, but it is what the route is publicly referred to by a developer who extensively worked on it, as is already noted on the route’s page. To be honest, I kind of fail to see how that’s not enough for it to be considered an official name.
While “Snowgrave Route” was the most popular name in the fanbase shortly after Chapter 2’s release when the poll was held, it has been my experience that the name has become significantly less common over the years since its initial discovery, with “Weird Route” becoming the more usual name I’ve seen used in contexts outside of this wiki. Of course this is anecdotal, and I don’t know the opinions of everyone on this wiki, but I feel like “Snowgrave Route” would be less likely to win if the same poll were held today. I also think that people will be more likely to be searching for “weird route” when looking up information about the upcoming chapters, so this could improve the wiki’s SEO on the topic.
This is speculative, but “Snowgrave Route” may become an increasingly less relevant name as the game continues in future chapters. The recent update to the secret pages on the Sweepstakes site has seemingly indicated that there will potentially be some form of continuation or at least consequence for the route in Chapter 3, which Noelle is not even known to be present in, so it may be unlikely that the Snowgrave spell could even be involved in it. Changing the page name to “Weird Route” would prevent the page name from becoming non-indicative for future developments in how the route may progress.
Relatedly, there’s also what could be a potential issue of the page as it exists being very long for a page that only covers events in a single chapter, that also might have to be expanded to cover several chapters in the near future. However, since the conditions and effects of the route in Chapter 2 alone are somewhat complicated, it may be difficult to shorten it without losing too much information.
This may be an over-complicated idea, and since the new chapters aren’t yet out it’s too early to actually apply it, but I think this could be resolved by making the page as it exists now into a subpage of a general “Weird Route” page, for example calling it “Weird Route/Chapter 2”. Similar pages could be made for the route/its differences in other applicable chapters, assuming things are extensive enough to warrant their own pages. The main Weird Route page could then provide a broad overview of the route overall and link to these subpages, and if the effects in any given chapter aren’t enough to warrant their own pages, then its description can be kept to a couple paragraphs on the main page. That’s just an idea I had though, it may be too convoluted so I’m not confident in it.
I hope I’m not overstepping with proposing this, since I only just started editing this wiki, but I do think this would be a good idea that would make it easier for the wiki to cover future chapters. It’s probably something where we’d have to wait to see how the new chapters go to see if it’s really necessary to do all this, but I hope I’ve made a decent argument!
I think we should definitely consider this once the new chapters release and we have a clearer picture of what the route is. It could be that the Snowgrave Route we take in Chapter 2 is disconnected from the alternative routes we can take in Chapter 4 or 5 and requires a completely separate article for it.
Fred Wood didn’t refer to the route as Weird back when the name was chosen, and we didn’t re-vote after that fact. But it was clear during the vote that the Snowgrave Route name wouldn’t make sense for future chapters, and that was fine because we didn’t know which name would make sense anyways.
I think if we go by the logic of a Chapter having an alternate route, it might be okay to have “Snowgrave” explicitly to describe Chapter 2’s events. But definitely not for overall. That we have to see on release.
I’m also with you on this one. I personally searched up “Weird Route” to find the page before realizing its called “Snowgrave Route” from the redirect. If the snowgrave spell shows up in the weird route when chapter 3 and 4 release there is a case to keep the name but if not, I also say it should probably be changed/re-polled.
i have to agree that snowgrave route sounds cooler than weird but it seems like a REALLY chapter 2 centric name. Same goes for pipis route. Weird route is a name that could be generalized for the entire game
This is just my opinion and I kind of already said it in my initial post, but I kind of feel like it shouldn’t be the wiki’s place to decide the name of a page based on what “sounds cool” over what official sources use. The page itself even has this strange section right now where it says the route has “no official name” and then goes on to cite several sources of a developer who very directly worked on the route consistently using a certain name for it, and if I’m being honest that section has bugged me for years because it feels like an awkward attempt to avoid having to deal with the fact it seems to have become clear that there is what can be reasonably assumed to be an official name, but the page was already named something else. (Of course, at the time the sourced posts were made it had only been a couple months since the vote for what the page should be called, so changing it then would have probably been especially awkward, but I think enough time has passed now that it could probably be accepted.)
Of course, I guess if one wanted to they could also argue that Fred Wood is only one member of the development team, so in theory it could still just be what he personally felt like calling it, but official sources that directly acknowledge the route by name are very rare. I can’t think of any other than his posts, even official patch notes for updates that affected the route either outright don’t mention route-related changes or do so extremely vaguely. Plus, he was calling it “Weird Route” in contexts where it was specifically being called “Snowgrave Route” by other people. The schedule for the January 2022 AGDQ event that his posts sourced on the page refer to did call the route “Snowgrave Route”, but he was repeatedly calling attention to it under the name “Weird Route”; I can’t say what he was thinking of course, but this sort of comes off to me like he may have been trying to stress “Weird Route” as the intended name over the fan one.
I’d say one specific name now has in-game evidence of being correct. Another name may also be feasible, but it’s likely to be a case of synonym replacement.
I’d say in a few days, we start the vote, and I’ll explain exactly what I’m talking about there. I’d rather not spoil it here. As they involve certain hidden routes in the new chapters. Say, what happens if I’m making a theory of these chapters, how would I spoiler tag the title so the TITLE doesn’t spoil it? I plan on making a thread addressing how deltarune.com/chapter5 should be interpreted in context to the new chapters. And later on a thread about something where even mentioning the thing it’s about would spoil a reveal.
Alright, since discussion on this is coming back, I’m responding here again. (Also check out what I said directly above this) I’ll also be showing up for whenever we vote on this. It’s also been a few days since the game came out, and the route is all over the place now, so I might as well say what I have to say here now,
We have in-game evidence, no longer relying on internal file names, that “Weird Route” is probably correct. First, in Chapter 4, that phrase is uttered by Susie in that route only, in response to Kris not high-fiving Susie regarding Noelle. Now, in Chapter 3, we have the Zelda counterpart to the Weird Route, which is nicknamed “Forbidden Path”. so that’s another possible name… but we learn from the Spamton Sweepstakes that this is based on Dragon Blazers, and from Gerson that it’s an adaption of an adaption (Gerson’s Lord of the Hammer) of the prophecy. I predict it went “Weird Route”->”The road not intended”->”Forbidden Path”?
Ah yeah Susie saying that is another support for this name being the "intended" name for the route. Also, about the Chapter 3 Forbidden Path thing, are you talking about the Sword Route? There is already an article for that and according to it "Sword Route" is the name used for it in the code. And if so, to me, the best thing would be for that to be covered completely separated from the Weird Route, and treating them like two different things.
No, i think what they mean is that one of the rooms in the Sword Route says "the forbidden path began with ice magic" right before the part where you get the mage and start freezing everyone. This is a major hint for how to start the Weird Route, and might be the intended way to discover it.
Ah I see I see. So yeah "forbidden path" could be another valid name for it, and mentioning that in the article would be neat. Still I think that Weird Route is the superior name.
I also consider Weird Route superior. I consider “Forbidden Path” as a distortion that came through the multiple layers of adaption. (Prophecy/Weird Route-> Lord of the Hammer/??? [Wrong Road? Atrocious Approach?]-> Dragon Blazers/Forbidden Path)
Okay so Dragon Blazers has an “Evil Route”. Yes, it’s called that. In Chapter 4, when you’re in the vase while in the basement, don’t move. Let Noelle talk. She’ll talk about the second game having an evil route. Further evidence that Dragon Blazers parallels Deltarune itself. This is another way the route could have been hinted at. Also Susie did the route by accident LOL
Probably not a very good name for an article though.