New Pages Discussion (Post-Chapter 3&4 Release)

Wiki Discussion
1

Hey all, in this post I wanted to propose some new pages for discussion before I formally create a few posts organizing future contribution efforts. Most of these are from SearchDigest, which means that people tried to search for these terms but there wasn't a suitable page for them.

Piano

The number 1 searched page on the wiki is "Piano". This could mean many things:

  • Piano puzzles in Dark Sanctuary
  • The big organ that Kris can play in the Dark Sanctuary
  • Piano that Kris can play in the hospital
  • Piano that Kris can play in Noelle's house
  • The information on /kris_dreemurr_kris/ about how Kris used to play the piano

Generally... we could have this as a disambiguation page between multiple different pages. But we could also create a "Piano" page that contains all of this information, since it appears to be an important concept in Deltarune. If so, should such a page describe the piano puzzles together with piano-related plot information, or should the page only describe the plot aspect and leave the gameplay aspect to the relevant location pages?

Angel

The second most searched page is "Angel". The Angel is indeed frequently mentioned in Deltarune (and a few times in Undertale as well), but talking about the Angel involves talking about Hometown's religion in general, and a more suitable page for talking about the religion in general would be the Legend of Delta Rune page. What do you think is the best option?

Party

The term "party" is not particularly searched for (19), but other names for the party ("fun gang" - 244, "the fun gang" - 62, "lancer fan club" - 32, "Fun Gang" - 27, "The Fun Gang" - 13).

We could direct these searches towards the Great Board page, where these names are described, or we could create a Party page (since the "party" is indeed mentioned in many of the articles) where both gameplay aspects and plot aspects of party members work are described. Or we could create a different kind of page that satisfies these queries?

Pacifist/Violence

Searches for "Pacifist" (158) and "Violence" (80) are especially significant. It sounds like users are trying to search for changes that occur when you fight or don't fight Darkners. What kind of page would correspond to that?

Festival

The Festival in Chapter 5 has been mentioned many times throughout the game already, and has 151 searches for it. Should we have a separate page documenting where the Festival has been mentioned, or mention these occurrences on the Chapter 5 article?

Disambiguations

Additionally, these pages should probably be disambiguations between multiple topics, but it's unclear what those topics should be:

  • Car
  • Code
  • Bonus
  • Statue

Thank you for participating in this discussion!

2

Heavily in favor of a PARTY page in the same vein as stats. It can contain information to do with the playable characters in LORE that addresses all of them as well as party mechanics and the unique way the party works in DELTARUNE (i.e Susie frequently running ahead, "removing" her from the party briefly in her absence). It can also include the party names from Chapter 1, or the party's roles / ties to the prophecy.

3
  • i dont think piano needs to be anything other than the puzzles. if they want to know that kris plays the piano they can go to kris's page. the only other thing i could see accounting for is maybe Piano that may not be played that well.
  • angel should direct to Legend of Delta Rune section with info on angel until we know more
  • party should have their own page
    • and it should be called the fuck squad/j
  • we should have a page for pacifist/violence differences. i don't know what thatd be like
4

Maybe referring to them as "routes"? They don't end differently but they do incur at times massive differences, namely loss / gain of recruits

5

i feel like "routes" would be the terminology people would automatically look for, because of its common use in undertale's community. the thing is that deltarune's different, with the "only one ending" hints... but violence or pacifism are still routes you go down, just leading to one destination, so i see it. i think that word would work

6

Especially with the disclaimer its there for searching and specify that Deltarunes "routes" are different from Undertale

7

Piano: I believe it should definitely just link to the gameplay pages. Whether it also links to lore pages (as disambiguation) or includes them as its own self-contained page is something I'm less sure about, but I don't think the different instances of pianos in the game are related enough concept to be worth compiling on their own page.

Angel: I think this one could work either way, as its own page or as a subheading in the page for the legend. I slightly prefer making it its own page, talking specifically about the entity mentioned in the religion as well as related symbolism.

Party: I think creating a party page makes a lot of sense; I believe it would fit some information that is otherwise only found deep in random pages about gameplay mechanics.

Pacifist/Violence: From my interactions with new players, I see people (especially those coming from Undertale) most frequently referring to these as routes, and hence it would make most sense to combine this somehow with the alternate routes page.

Festival: I think this one should simply redirect to Chapter 5, even without the list of references.

Car: I think the most likely things to be asking about are the minicar recruit in Chapter 2 and the slashed tires at the end of Chapter 2. Some less likely to be searched for but still related concepts are the car guy in Chapter 2's light world, Toriel's car in general, the Annoying Dog car that runs you over sometimes, or the car sequence with Queen in Chapter 2 in general.

Code: I think the most likely things for this one are accessing the source code for the game, the card puzzles in Chapter 1, the codes required to open doors in Chapter 3, the piano codes in Chapter 4, and the codes to the shelter/Catti's house.

Bonus: The bonus zones in chapter 3 (The two that Tenna describes as bonus zones in the two boards, and the big flashing one in TV world too). I have no idea what else someone searching for this would be looking for.

Statue: Darkners turning to stone are pretty much the only statues I can think of in the game, so a page about this would be about such instances and why it happens.

(edit: added spoiler tags)

8

>Piano
Yeah, i think a big disambiguation page would be good for that.

>Angel
The Religion of Deltarune should 100% be a separate page from the Legend of Delta Rune imo. They're pretty independent objects in-universe. And then the Angel could possibly be yet another separate page on top of that, bringing up the diverse angel imagery that's appeared throughout the game.

>Party
could def get a page of its own. Otherwise it should at least get a disambiguation page linking to each individual characters and stats.

>Pacifist/Violence
A page documenting the changes between pacifist and violence would be very useful, yeah.

>Festival.
Could just be Chapter 5.

9

Piano: A page would be really good. Just with piano-related plot information, and an easy way to get where each piano puzzle is described (because you’ll probably get there before getting to the actual piano puzzles help really is, but that it’s well placed)

Angel: Maybe it’s a little early to treat it as a character (I mean, giving it its own page) but it also would be helpful.

Party: Isn’t just relevant to the Great Board, so a page for it (where both gameplay aspects and plot aspects of party members work are described).

Pacifist/Violence: A page documenting all changes by comparison.

Festival: In chapter 5 it’s fine.

Car: I think that’s about the cars in chapter 2. The roller coaster ones, the ones with feet.. It can be a compilation of all the cars that have appeared, or haven been mentioned in general (like the Cungadero, Asgore’s truck…), but it's not important that it exists.

Statue: A documentation of the ones in chapter 4? But it’s also related to the darkness and even that Berdly thing... I would say, a compilation (Tenna one, Susie one, etc) or nothing.

10

would it make sense to create a page for the number 1225? considering it appears multiple times in the game it could be useful to have a very short article that lists all of the times it appears (i believe 4 times explicitly so far?)

11

that just got added at https://deltarune.wiki/w/December_Holiday#1225 earlier today!

12

If I may: documentation regarding the Angel brings into question the nature of the Legend of the Delta Rune article. More specifically, how the distinction of Deltarune as a fictitious religious concept and the Prophecy is handled.

See, the Deltarune seems to exist as a sort of symbol, perchance a means of connection to fate. Meanwhile, the Prophecy is fate itself: the rules in which the world's future is to play out. These two ideas not only seem to be establishing themselves as separate topics worthy of independent coverage, though even in Undertale had been referred to with separation. Given this, perhaps "Deltarune (symbol)" and "Prophecy" could be topics of their own respective articles?

As for the Angel themselves, their true nature-- in regards to blatant canon-- is still quite unknown. For the time being, "Angel" may best fit as a disambiguation page, linking to the aforementioned Deltarune and Prophecy, though additionally towards the player and Noelle Holiday respectively for their connections.

13

I'm uncertain on Piano and Angel at this time. Otherwise:

  • Party article:

I think it's fine to have an article on it. It can list when certain characters are/are not in the team. Maybe even very temporary moments? Some of them are for gags.

  • Pacifist/Violence:

Contextually this fits Chapter 1's "ending" the most, but differences would be of interest.

  • Festival:

If it has a proper name/location it could have its own article, but it may be best to have citations in Chapter 5 for now.

Disambiguations:

Car: The tiny Electro-Dasher is likely it, and I remember adding the word "car" at the end of Electro-Dasher so it could be searchable. The weird issue with this word is that it keeps cropping up occasionally at random times?

Code: Looks like it can apply to both Chapter 3 and 4, which is unfortunately quite a bit.

Bonus: I'm assuming it's Chapter 3's Bonus Room.

Statue: Either the lore about Darkners.... or some Completion File choices that can transfer. Also apparently there's a Tenna Statue that can be earned?

14
  1. Piano: I think this is the point at which we finally start implementing puzzle pages like on the Undertale Wiki. Any information about the piano puzzles would be on a Dark Sanctuary puzzle pages, and we would implement them across all other locations
  2. Angel: We don’t really know a lot about the Angel as a plot element yet to really make this a separate page. I’m leaning in favor of documenting what we know so far on the Legend of Delta Rune page for now.
  3. Party: I agree with the proposal of making a separate Party article, though I’m not sure how much, if any, information would overlap with already established articles such as Stats. I suppose we’ll have to see where it goes.
  4. Pacifist/Violence: We already have a category for alternate routes. I think we could transform that into a real article and document any differences between pacifist and violent routes there.
  5. Festival: Similar situation with Angel, unfortunately. Unless we want to make a stubby article, we don’t have much information to go off of. However, I don’t see the harm of preemptively making a Festival article with the information we have now. We did that for Dragon Blazers, and that worked out nicely.
15

Piano: I think this should be a disambiguation page. The various instances of pianos are too different in terms of their functionality and importance for it to be worth combining in my opinion.

Angel: I think the angel will become increasingly important, but because it's likely to end up being one of the characters who already has a page, I think having it redirect to Legend of Delta Rune for now makes the most sense (maybe with some more angel-specific info on that page).

Party: I think this could be its own page. It could describe both the game mechanics relevant to the party (who can join, what menus you have) and also the party's role in the plot and the legend. I think "Heroes" or "Legendary Heroes" would be a better name for such a page, though.

Pacifist/Violence: I think this should redirect to the Recruits page, which has a list of changes if you recruit or don't recruit darkners.

Festival: I think this should be its own page, and we have enough info about what it generally is to be able to have enough content for a page.

As for the other disambiguations, I'm honestly not sure. Those four seem general enough to be referring to lots of things. Here are what I thought of:
Car: Queen's car, the legend of Queen's car, Toriel's car, the ch2 car accident
Code: The various codes for TV world, the shelter, Catty's house door, etc.
Bonus: The bonus board from ch3, the bonus room from ch3
Statue: The concept of darkners turning to statues, the statue of Gerson in ch4, the Berdly statue in ch2.

16

I think the Delta Warriors should have their own page, and I think Pacifist and Violence could fit in the Recruits article with a little reworking.

17

I think statue should perhaps be a disambiguation, including every statue that has a page.

Sound of Justice does seem like it should be included, along with whatever page includes Darkners turning to stone.