I added it back recently and just noticed somebody removed it. Do people actually think a motif needs to be a perfect match to be in a song? Obviously not.
The misconception comes from people looking at the first two measures of the "The Door" motif when the part in THE WORLD REVOLVING is actually a near-perfect match for the second two measures.
If we only include perfect matches for motifs, then three-quarters of all entries on the leitmotifs shouldn't be there, and that obviously isn't right.
The Door, The Chase, And Black Knife, e.g. The Knight’s motif, originating from Nightmare Knight, consist of the following notes:
G-Eb-Eb-D-Bb-G-F-Ab
The World Revolving, when transposed to the same key, is:
Eb-Ab-B-Bb-Ab-Eb-F
So yeah, you’re right about one thing.
It sure isn’t a perfect match.
Nowhere near it.
Like
A LONG way away from a perfect match.
Now, in case I have misread, and you were talking about the second variation of the Door’s motif that plays right after:
G-Eb-Eb-D-Bb-G-Ab-Bb
Wow that’s really really super duper close to the world revolving it goes up at the end! oh my god they’re the same because they go up and down and up and down and end going up (to entirely different notes of the scale, may I add. TWR goes up to the 5th, and Knight goes up to the 7th.)
Just to check how accurate your method is, try the same thing with "sans.", "It's Raining Somewhere Else", and "Song That Might Play When You Fight Sans". They're nowhere near each other! Clearly they share no leitmotifs.
Also, if you line the two up by slowing THE WORLD REVOLVING down and offsetting it by sixteen measures (because of Black Knife's intro), they line up perfectly, with near-identical chord changes and even tonicizing to Bb major at the same time. Clearly they were meant to sound similar.
Had a feeling you’d bring that up.
Problem is, while sans is the only melody playing in it’s raining, and is the main melody, your sighting of ‘the door’ is but one fragment of TWR that is brushed over incredibly quickly.
If it’s not a focus, not even the same notes, not even same rhythm, then it’s pretty far from a leitmotif.
Additionally, how does me lowering both TWR and Black Knife down a few semitones to match the door throw things off? I can assure you, that’s not how music works.
They were not intended to sound similar, and you should really just stop pedaling your flimsy argument.
Good day.
I will not be entertaining this (frankly dull) conversation further.
"But one fragment that is brushed over incredibly quickly?"
It's the intro to the song and it's played twice, what???
Your argument kinda makes me think of Snowdin being in Hopes and Dreams. "It's just a small part and they're not immediately apparently thematically connected, so we shouldn't say it's a quote."
I'm going to look more into your original analysis in a bit, but regardless of what I find I feel this argument definitely needed to be called out. It's ridiculous.